The freehold of the Dartmouth Arms has recently been acquired. Not sure whether the new owners have acquired for owner occupation or whether there’s a new occupier lined up. Also, does anyone know the type of operator taking on the ex KFH unit?
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NISA has a track record including turning former pubs into NISA convenience stores. I wonder if that is to be the fate of the Dartmouth Arms.
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Seems likely https://camra.org.uk/pubs/leighton-arms-holloway-124869 - looks like we get the terrible versions of Tesco AND Co-op on Dartmouth Road now 
Leighton Arms was heavily protested by the community: Kentish Town pub turned into a shop had ‘not been supported by community’ | Camden New Journal
That’s a sad end to the pub. Unfortunately I fear that despite it being locally listed and in a conservation area, Lewisham council will not go out of their way to preserve this ex-pub.
Once it is turned into a convenience store most of the internal features will be destroyed and it won’t be able to be returned to a pub. I also notice that that car park was not included in the sale.
And having the store run by a company based in Swansea doesn’t bode well for particular concern about the local community and improving the area.
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They’re well-placed to write the manual ‘how to destroy a once-thriving community’.
Will there be a change of use application that we can oppose?
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I don’t believe there have been any planning applications put in yet for alterations to the building - but I will be sure to flag on this forum if we do receive one, and will make sure people know how to express their views on it so we can take that feedback into planning committee.
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The Boots store would make a perfectly good site for a convenience store. There is really no excuse for this level of urban vandalism to a pub that has a history (although not the same building) of pubs on this site since it was a canal 200 years ago.
I also wouldn’t be surprised if this becomes our new post office. This is clearly the wrong pub to turn into a post office on Dartmouth Road - I can think of a much more suitable one.
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That has made me feel sick!
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Or how about WH Smiths as a great location for a convenience store, perhaps with a post office included?
A Nisa (or M&S Food) in that spot would be sensible, but the conversion of the Dartmouth Arms is two wasted opportunities.
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NISA Dunvant does not own any operational pubs so unless it is making a huge step away from its core business it’s hard to see them doing anything other than leasing it as a new NISA. Some NISA stores are also Post Offices,
Hard to see them leasing it as a pub
It’s still conjecture at this point though isn’t it. Background to NISA below.
I looked up Nisa Dunvant Ltd and they appear to own just one One Stop shop on a council estate on the outer edge of Swansea. Moving into Zone 3 London property is an interesting move!
Is the DA currently a restaurant use class or a pub? I can’t see any recent change of use info on the Lewisham site.
I wonder whether it might be possible to register the pub as a community asset of architectural and historic importance (within the existing Conservation Area) as was done for the Greyhound in Sydenham? There’s even a Government fund for protecting pubs, so maybe this could be tapped as well?
I’m not sure we’re in the market to make it a Community run pub, but surely the building could be put to a more appropriate (and less damaging) use?
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It is still regarded as a pub in planning terms. The only changes made when Meatliquor took over was for external lighting.
We are probably a bit late to the table for making it an asset of community value (although it can’t do any harm). This would have allowed the community the right to purchase the pub at a market rate. But it can’t do any harm for the Forest Hill Society to get it listed as an ACV now.
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Thanks. Would that not make it very challenging to switch it from a pub, given that they have to demonstrate its non-viability for that use? Which I expect would be a high bar to clear given its strong location?
The requirement to provide evidence of non-viability for a pub’s business was introduced by the previous Lewisham administration. I do not believe there are many other London boroughs who have any similar poorly thought through planning requirement or constraint in place. It has little or no merit.
It might be anticipated that any prospective purchaser with good King’s Counsel advice on board will readily dispense with the provision and proceed regardless.
I’m thinking of the national NPPF policy that has just come in, not a local policy
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It is noted this item was published in mid-August 2026 and appears to define a requirement of proof that a business has been marketed for at least 12 months supposedly as a “protection” measure.
Lewisham Council passed its version of the constraint some years ago and it specified the requirement of submission of evidence of a three-year period of business non-viability.
Is either measure based on evidence of potential success in terms of protection or that there is some other merit in it?
I cannot think of a single candidate or planning submission involving a pub actually considered by a Lewisham Planning Committee where the Lewisham Council constraint played any material part in their deliberation. And we see an ongoing trend of local businesses going dark with the shutters appearing shortly after.
Local pub businesses and restaurants continue to suffer hardships stretching back to the Covid Pandemic and recovery can only be described as weak - there are many more realistic measures that have a greater positive impact than these poorly defined constraints.
OK, my point is simply that with the pub use class comes a real planning constraint and in this case - town centre location, close to transport, heritage value, a going concern until quite recently (when it was closed because of problems with the wider Meat Liquor business leading to a big downsizing, not a site-specific viability issue) - the burden of proof is likely to be greater to justify a change of use.
Also bear in mind that “Nisa Dunvant Ltd” isn’t, afaict, a big chain of stores - it’s a small family franchisee, possibly with only one store (in a fringe location on a council estate in Swansea). It’s possible that this endeavour is just some a distinct commercial/residential property investment not related to their shop business - the foregrounding of ‘public house’ in the write up supports this.
I feel your points re NISA are potentially well founded and some of the points made in the accompanying trade press piece are not particularly accurate - Meat Liquor cannot at this time be considered a going concern on that site for example. The freehold of the property was marketed last year and Meat Liquor, separately, went dark earlier this year.
I think the only point of disagreement is just how “real” is either constraint and would either survive first contact with a business organisation with a good KC.
You are right of course that a change of use application would have to be strong on any other factors that materially affect the LPA decision making process.
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The DA is such a beautiful building and to see it ruined and turned into a sub-par convenience store would be a travesty.
It’d be a great spot for a community cafe and pub..we NEED something like Nunhead’s Ivy House here
The Dartmouth Arms would have been a perfect spot for that, Or a cafe by day bar by night kind of place perhaps operating as a bar just 3 evenings a week.
We already have the ‘Tesco one stop shop’ place next to Sylvan Post so having Nisa (which is not ‘nicer’ in any way shape or form) opposite makes no sense,
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