Do we need another cafe? I think Forest Hill would support a high quality gastro pub. The back room of the old Dartmouth Arms had an OK vibe as a dining space. However, investors might be more inclined to come into the area if the council cleaned the grime off the pavements, make it look like someone cares.
I’m trying to read the linked article and all I get from their site is “Sorry that page has not been found”.
I wonder if it’s been taken down.
I think a Cafe that offers the sort of food Aga’s offered by day (rather than just coffee and cakes) reasonably priced as Aga’s was and also with healthy salad/vegan/veggie options is needed.
Perhaps with pop ups in the evening offering various cuisines, the space is large enough to house community workshops/classes at the back too.
I think a high quality gastro pub would struggle I don’t know that there’s the demographic here to keep it busy enough to turn a profit, there are lots of families in the area and they may consider popping out to Bona for an early evening family meal on a weekday but I don’t think a gastro-pub would have a busy food service 7 days a week.
I really hope there are historic grounds to object to this. The Dartmouth Arms gave it’s name to Forest Hill station originally as the local inn in Victorian times. I can’t see a post office fitting in alongside a store - maybe I’m underestimating how you can flip it, but it’s not a massive pub.
Plenty of ways you could do something different with it to provide a different kind of social space to the area - look at Badger Badger Badger in Norwood for example. Board game pub would be cool. Community cafe / pub sounds lovely too. Great points on the number of other retail units that could be used for a Nisa - I wonder why they’re so keen on flipping pubs 
3 Likes
Yes it may have been taken down. Maybe they are not so keen on publicity after all. It basically said that this firm of solicitors had managed a complex deal to buy at auction with some existing leases the Dartmouth Arms on behalf of NISA Dunvant /its two directors Balwinder Kaur and Gurpinder Singh.
3 Likes
The link is still live and I have accessed it again this morning.
The article also said there are two flats above the pub - it didn’t say whether they are privately owned or rented but there was reference to dealing with multiple leases and no mention of tennants, so I guess that points to the flats being privately owned?
There was also a description of finances involved: getting loans and personal guarantees in place in time for the auction transaction.
It’s not there for me. If you can still see it, please would you save a copy? Try “Print” and save to pdf. Thanks.
What a potential waste and destruction of a good space. The Dartmouth Arms really should be kept as a food and/or drink venue, and ideally of a similar quality as MEATliquer. Something similar to what you would find on the high street in East Dulwich. These are the kind of establishments we need on the Forest Hill high street. We’ve got some great coffee shops, and a really nice dentist, but other than that Forest Hill now seems to be full of charity shops, nail shops, low quality fast food shops, betting shops and convenience stores. How can we get it heading in the direction of East Dulwich and Crystal Palace rather than Forest Gate?
2 Likes
Have created the PDF - but this board’s message system will not let me send it to you as an attachment - if you pm me your email I’ll send it to you.
1 Like
My interpretation was that Meat Liqour had a lease over the whole including the flats. Meat Liqour went into administration and this new company have taken over the lease (not the Freehold but may be wrong), and paid a premium as mentioned in the article, of the whole property for occupation of their concept (still unknown but suggests NISA). Brave move considering they don’t have planning, would have to go through it and seems like they’d be considerable opposition if it is down a NISA type route.
Agreed, it should definitely remain as a pub/leisure use given the history. Would be great to see someone like The Talbot in Brockley or small independent pub group take it.
1 Like
I would prefer higher quality. Why can’t we have a Michelin star in Forest Hill?
1 Like
Correcting an error on my part - the Peter Lynn and Partners website has deleted all references to the article.
Will check the Wayback Machine in case there is a copy present there.
There isn’t, I already looked.
1 Like
Neither Google AI nor Co-Pilot can provide the text of the article but Co-Pilot has produced a very detailed summary (including “The acquisition was structured as a transfer of a going concern (TOGC). In practical terms, this meant the transaction was treated as the transfer of an ongoing business operation rather than merely the sale of a physical property.”):
=========
Detailed Summary
The article reports on a significant commercial property acquisition in London completed by a South Wales-based business owner with legal support from Peter Lynn and Partners Solicitors. The transaction centred on the purchase of The Dartmouth Arms, a property located in Forest Hill, South East London, and is presented as the buyers’ first commercial property venture outside Wales.
The Parties Involved
The legal work was led by Ashley Leung of Peter Lynn and Partners Solicitors, acting for purchasers Balwinder Kaur and Gurpinder Singh. Balwinder Kaur is identified as a co-director of NISA Dunvant Limited. Funding support and finance coordination were provided by Mark Standley of Standout Capital Solutions.
The Property
The acquired property is a mixed-use asset comprising:
A public house operating from the ground floor.
Two self-contained residential flats located above the pub.
Existing tenants and occupiers, meaning the property was already producing activity and required continuity of operations during the ownership transfer.
The article notes that the property spans multiple levels and combines commercial trading premises with residential accommodation, making the transaction more involved than a straightforward purchase of a single-use building.
Auction Purchase and Time Pressures
A central theme of the article is the urgency associated with auction purchases. Because the property had been acquired through an auction process, there was a fixed completion deadline that could not easily be extended. The legal team therefore had to manage multiple workstreams simultaneously while ensuring all requirements were completed in time.
Additional pressure came from the funding arrangements. The purchase was financed through a loan package involving a debenture and personal guarantees. Completion needed to occur before the lender’s offer expired, meaning delays could potentially have jeopardised financing as well as the purchase itself.
Legal Complexity
The article highlights the number of legal issues that had to be addressed during the transaction. According to the report, the legal team had to:
Review an extensive auction legal pack.
Satisfy lender requirements.
Undertake title investigations and due diligence.
Review search results and associated risks.
Coordinate the various lease arrangements affecting the property.
Keep all parties aligned to meet the fixed completion date.
A substantial part of the work involved reporting to solicitors acting on behalf of Atom Bank. This reporting covered title matters, search results, due diligence findings, and risk considerations connected with the property.
Lease Structure
One of the more complex aspects of the deal was the property’s leasing arrangements. The article states that the transaction involved:
A headlease.
A sublease.
Two occupational leases.
A licence to assign.
Managing these overlapping interests required careful legal review so that the purchasers, lender, and other stakeholders understood exactly what rights and obligations would continue after completion.
VAT and Going Concern Structure
The acquisition was structured as a transfer of a going concern (TOGC). In practical terms, this meant the transaction was treated as the transfer of an ongoing business operation rather than merely the sale of a physical property.
The article explains that this structure required close coordination between the purchasers and their accountant. The objective was to satisfy the conditions necessary for VAT not to be charged on the purchase price, creating a potentially significant financial advantage for the buyers.
Funding Coordination
The story emphasises the importance of synchronisation between the legal and finance teams. Mark Standley describes the financing timetable as critical and explains that funding had to be available and ready for drawdown precisely when required. Close collaboration between the finance and legal advisers helped ensure that money would be available before the relevant deadlines expired.
Managing an Occupied Property
Because tenants were already in place, the transaction involved more than simply transferring ownership. The parties had to coordinate carefully to ensure a smooth handover from seller to buyer while avoiding disruption to the property’s ongoing commercial and residential activities.
Client Perspective
The purchasers describe the transaction as their first commercial property acquisition outside Wales and acknowledge that numerous issues had to be managed within a short timeframe. They credit both the legal and finance teams with providing clear guidance, acting promptly, and helping them complete before the deadline.
Broader Message of the Article
The article ultimately serves as a case study demonstrating how experienced legal and finance professionals can manage complicated commercial property acquisitions where multiple challenging factors arise simultaneously. These factors included:
Auction deadlines.
Lending requirements.
Multiple lease arrangements.
Existing occupational interests.
VAT and tax considerations.
Tight financing timelines.
Ongoing business operations at the property.
The article concludes by suggesting that the successful completion of the purchase marks an important expansion into the London commercial property market for Balwinder Kaur and Gurpinder Singh. It also highlights the role of coordinated legal and financial advice in helping clients seize opportunities in complex, time-sensitive property transactions. The piece ends by inviting readers interested in similar commercial property purchases to contact Ashley Leung at Peter Lynn and Partners Solicitors.
4 Likes
Good piece of work on recreation of the summary.
It contains some odd assertions including the fact the property had been acquired through an auction process and complexities on leases and the matter of there being a TOGC present.
Could it be that Meat Liquor is still considered to be a going concern?
Despite the company name ‘Nisa Dunvant Limited’ and a few online references to a Nisa store at 1-3 Derlwyn, Dunvant, the shop at that address is actually branded ‘One Stop’ (the same franchise that opened elsewhere on Dartmouth Road in December 2025) and has been since at least May 2019 (Google Street View). Before that it was Costcutter.
Maybe the same company has operated the store for years and has changed franchises, but I don’t see a connection with the Nisa brand.
1 Like
First, the drastic change in The Capitol’s use, and now this. After 25 years of being in the area, it really makes me sad for the future of FH’s high street.
Erasing the history of a pub so closely tied to this location would be a huge loss. And seriously, do we really need yet another potentially dreadful and completely unnecessary shop, too…?
I mean, that part of Dartmouth Road (next to and opposite the Sylvan Arms) with all that square footage and the large pedestrian space perfect for “al fresco” use had so much potential to become FH’s own “dining/drinking quarter”: somewhere for residents to enjoy and a reason for people from outside the area to venture in (a win win for businesses) Instead, we got a One Stop Shop, and now potentially another one of the same ilk.
I really hope the whole neighbourhood resists this. I’ll comment, sign, join in and do whatever is needed — apart from placard protests
3 Likes
AI is really proving it’s worth today. Google ‘Dartmouth Arms property auction’ and you get gems such as:
Details: Freehold public house investment opportunity marketed via Savills Commercial.
Financials: Listed with offers invited in excess of £1,450,000 (8.1% Net Initial Yield), producing a current rent of £125,063 per annum under a lease running until May 2036.
Lease Terms: The property was let on a 15-year lease running until May 2036.
Tenant Covenant: The entire property was let to Meatailer Limited (the operators behind the MEATliquor brand). Note that while the commercial lease covenant remained active, the venue itself was closed.
And this bombshell:
Development Potential: Separate parcels of land directly adjacent to the pub have previously been evaluated by Savills for independent residential development.
Which led me to this:
I haven’t yet researched further to see if that plot has been sold.
1 Like
The Savills document about land adjacent to the pub was dated July 2024.
Benefit of a pre-app response from Lewisham Council for an 8 residential apartment scheme extending to 6,427 sq ft Indicative architect scheme for a four storey apartment building with associated parking, landscaping and amenities
Adjoining public house unaffected by sale
Guide Price - Offers in excess of £700,000 on a subject to contract only basis
The site has potential for the erection of a four storey building comprising 8 residential apartments with associated amenities, parking and landscaping subject to obtaining the necessary planning consents. We have provided an indicative scheme on Page 5. Parties should undertake their own due diligence and planning enquiries for the site. Our client has undertaken two pre-application meetings with Lewisham Council regarding the potential development of the car park in its entirety.
SERVICES We understand the land is not connected to any services. Purchasers are advised to make their own enquiries with the supply companies in respect of their specific requirements.
Interestingly the plot didn’t include the land directly next to the pub which gives access to the car park. There’s a note in one of the illustrations saying “Land to be retained [with the Dartmouth Arms building] but with rights of way granted over this”.